Of course. As an anarchist, you don’t want to say…
I know, but you have a budget, right? You have, in this budget…
You have no budget at all?
Absolute, but still you have people who have more practical technology, people you’re saying…
What about them?
I’ve talked to some people in preparation for this. Those who are more critical – everybody likes you, that’s very obvious…
Absolutely.
Those who are more critical about rather not you as a person but your role, they say…
OK.
Like those people. They are basically like, “But it’s still politics. She’s on the government. She doesn’t really have a budget. She doesn’t really have staff. That’s what you need if you really want to change things.” Of course, you don’t agree.
You don’t change things?
Of course, but you’re here for something. You have a reason?
Even if you say you don’t change things – maybe I’m not precise enough – you want to change the culture, right?
I want to go back to one thing you mentioned here at this meeting yesterday, about digital development I think you said.
Before.
The ministry meeting, the Ministry of Economy.
What is your role exactly in that kind of meeting?
Did they come to you? Why? What do they want to have from you?
What did you suggest yesterday?
That doesn’t sound necessarily like what you would imagine if somebody thinks of you as a digital minister.
Sorry?
What does that mean?
You’re a lower-case minister. Still then, normally, you would preach something, which would, in this case as digital minister, I would suspect would be, “Hey guys, we should use this occasion to push for a digital payment system.”
That’s very interesting. I think the way many governments and also experts understand digital and digitalization is basically to put everything on the Internet and computers…
Why?
That’s very interesting. I guess you don’t like the term smart city at all, right?
Maybe we can forget my structure and continue with the flow of the conversation.
Still, like the smart city, this label is very much used in Taiwan as well, for example, right?
Wise city in Chinese? How do you say that in Chinese?
Is that different from the smart city?
It’s really different?
Usually, the translation for smart city in Chinese…
…is the wise city. That’s very interesting.
Do you know how they say it in China in Chinese.
Is this concept really very much different in practice as well from the Western concept of smart city?
I was more talking to you about the difference between the Taiwanese concept of the wise city versus the Western concept of smart cities, which are often just technology-driven cities.
Yeah. Do you have a cup of water maybe?
Oh, I see. You have the…
I know they came in last year.
When are you here?
Because you have meetings?
Because you had meetings with Doug Atsel.
Yeah. [laughs]
You just said, “I’m still attending the cabinet meeting.” What does that mean, “still”?
Ah, in that sense.
It sounds like, “I would rather not, but I have to.”
You wonder why?
You wanted to stay, absolutely? Or were you thinking about…
Really? How can you not care about being a minister or not?
